"When I take action, I'm not going to fire a $2 million missile at a $10 empty tent and hit a camel in the butt. It's going to be decisive." - George W. Bush

"Promise a young man that death is not the end and he will willingly cause disaster."

I can't help get the feeling from this show that if America goes to war, despite being all about it right now... we will tire of it quickly. If the images of innocents dying aren't censored by the media, which they will be, those who are gung ho now will likely realize the scope of what's going on. I keep hearing "we have to do this, we have to fight back" despite most people not wanting to do so. There's something in that. I don't know what the fuck we are going to do. I'm just scared shitless of where this is all going to lead. Blah, i had so much to say watching this stuff, but it's all gone. It's too much to process.

"A former CIA operative explains why the terrorist Usama bin Ladin has little to fear from American intelligence."

"I've been hearing a lot of talk about "bombing Afghanistan back to the Stone Age." Ronn Owens, on KGO Talk Radio today, allowed that this would mean killing innocent people, people who had nothing to do with this atrocity, but "we're at war, we have to accept collateral damage. What else can we do?" Minutes later I heard some TV pundit discussing whether we "have the belly to do what must be done."

And I thought about the issues being raised especially hard because I am from Afghanistan, and even though I've lived here for 35 years I've never lost track of what's going on there. So I want to tell anyone who will listen how it all looks from where I'm standing.

I speak as one who hates the Taliban and Osama Bin Laden. There is no doubt in my mind that these people were responsible for the atrocity in New York. I agree that something must be done about those monsters.

But the Taliban and Ben Laden are not Afghanistan. They're not even the government of Afghanistan. The Taliban are a cult of ignorant psychotics who took over Afghanistan in 1997. Bin Laden is a political criminal with a plan. When you think Taliban, think Nazis. When you think Bin Laden, think Hitler. And when you think "the people of Afghanistan" think "the Jews in the concentration camps." It's not only that the Afghan people had nothing to do with this atrocity. They were the first victims of the perpetrators. They would exult if someone would come in there, take out the Taliban and clear out the rats nest of international thugs holed up in their country.

Some say, why don't the Afghans rise up and overthrow the Taliban? The answer is, they're starved, exhausted, hurt, incapacitated, suffering.

A few years ago, the United Nations estimated that there are 500,000 disabled orphans in Afghanistan--a country with no economy, no food.

There are millions of widows. And the Taliban has been burying thesewidows alive in mass graves. The soil is littered with land mines, the farms were all destroyed by the Soviets. These are a few of the reasons why the Afghan people have not overthrown the Taliban.

We come now to the question of bombing Afghanistan back to the Stone Age. Trouble is, that's been done. The Soviets took care of it already.

Make the Afghans suffer? They're already suffering. Level their houses? Done. Turn their schools into piles of rubble? Done. Eradicate their hospitals? Done. Destroy their infrastructure? Cut them off from medicine and health care? Too late. Someone already did all that.

New bombs would only stir the rubble of earlier bombs. Would they at least get the Taliban? Not likely. In today's Afghanistan, only the Taliban eat, only they have the means to move around. They'd slip away and hide. Maybe the bombs would get some of those disabled orphans, they don't move too fast, they don't even have wheelchairs. But flying over Kabul and dropping bombs wouldn't really be a strike against the criminals who did this horrific thing. Actually it would only be making common cause with the Taliban--by raping once again the people they've been raping all this time

So what else is there? What can be done, then? Let me now speak with true fear and trembling. The only way to get Bin Laden is to go in there with ground troops. When people speak of "having the belly to do what needs to be done" they're thinking in terms of having the belly to kill as many as needed. Having the belly to overcome any moral qualms about killing innocent people. Let's pull our heads out of the sand. What's actually on the table is Americans dying. And not just because some Americans would die fighting their way through Afghanistan to Bin Laden's hideout. It's much bigger than that folks. Because to get any troops to Afghanistan, we'd have to go through Pakistan. Would they let us? Not likely. The conquest of Pakistan would have to be first. Will other Muslim nations just stand by? You see where I'm going. We're flirting with a world war between Islam and the West.

And guess what: that's Bin Laden's program. That's exactly what he wants. That's why he did this. Read his speeches and statements. It's all right there. He really believes Islam would beat the west. It might seem ridiculous, but he figures if he can polarize the world into Islam and the West, he's got a billion soldiers. If the west wreaks a holocaust in those lands, that's a billion people with nothing left to lose, that's even better from Bin Laden's point of view. He's probably wrong, in the end the west would win, whatever that would mean, but the war would last for years and millions would die, not just theirs but ours. Who has the belly for that? Bin Laden does. Anyone else?"

-Tamim Ansary

"We have all been shocked and deeply saddened by the recent events. There is nothing that I can say or do that will lessen the impact and repercussions of such a horrendous act. I know that some of you have lost close friends or you are dealing with the uncertainty of their fate. All of us have been affected by these events. Please know that you and your family are important to me and to this company. I realize that everyone needs to deal with this situation in his or her own way. If you need time off, the company will support your decision.

President Bush has proclaimed Friday, September 14, 2001, as a national day of prayer and remembrance for the victims of the terrorist attacks. He has asked that places of worship mark this day with noontime memorial services, the ringing of bells at that hour, and evening candlelight vigils. If you would like to attend these services, you are encouraged to do so.

If you would like to assist in the relief efforts by making a donation to the Red Cross, the company will match your donation. Your HR department will send out additional information on this program.

Please know that if you or your family need help in any way, the company is here to assist you.

Sincerely,

George"

"i've been told where i should stand just this side of the line that says that is wrong and this is righteous don't cross that line and keep your voice down because no one wants to hear of other ways cause we all need to be saved from mistakes we've made but not me i'll live out my life the way i see and i'll sink my faith in what's in me and in truth and where freedom lives where we choose not damnation not lines that split us up and no i don't want to be saved from this world cause i believe it's beautiful and worth fighting for"

"there's kepone in the river but the river's still flowing east ethyl dozed the planet in an attempt to keep the downtown clean still it's a beautiful day and the sun is still shining over the james oregon hill is at end time vcu crept up and lit the torch west ave. honkeys don't forget that trains still run north third per-capita next year number one"

It's a beautiful beautiful beautiful day.

Enough of the black background.

"I am a mixture of so many emotions at this point.
A sense of pride for my fellow citizen and support for this great country and a feeling of distrust that my government, 'of the people' isn't true to sound motivations or intentions.
I truely don't know who is the greater evil, while I certainly can't condone the recent actions."
--Ben Miller (gleaned from the empeg BBS of all places)

My friend Garrett at work sent me these links (1,2)to some RAM files of Dave Emory's (KFJC, Los Altos Hills) broadcast called "What does the W in George W. Bush Stand for". I'm not meaning to jump on the Bin Laden bandwagon, but listen to Bush's links to Laden's family and business ties. You won't hear about any of this on CNN. It's very long, but well worth the listen.

Chris [slashdot]

Not sure how to start commenting on all this. One thing that i've been mentally focusing on is what's going to happen to our civil liberties after all this. I see former NSA and FBI heads on the news talking about the lack of intelligence and the failure of our intelligence system. They are all calling for an increase in monitoring and human intelligence. Human Intelligence, go for it, whatever, but i hope we don't see a huge backlash upon all of our privacy as a result of this.

I don't wanna argue this point with anyone right now, so don't bother commenting.